Tag: pastoral succession

2_03: Daniel Im – Should You Stay or Should You Go?

2_03: Daniel Im – Should You Stay or Should You Go?

Breakthrough ideas with Daniel: 

  • What does it look like to live your life with our hands wide open saying, “Lord, here we are?”
  • Every leader, every pastor, goes through those seasons where restlessness clouds every conversation. What do you do?
  • A lot of leaders that come to those seasons of the restlessness, but how do we know if it’s really time to take the next step?
  • Does unsettledness come as a result of prayer and scripture? Or should unsettledness drive you to deeper times of prayer and time in the Word?
  • It is less critical where your feet are and more important as to where your heart is.
  • It doesn’t matter if we stay, and it doesn’t matter if we go, because we know that we are in God’s hands and that He is a good Father.
  • What would it look like to submit to the Lord rather than trying to lead our lives on our own?
  • Bigger and better opportunities aren’t necessarily always from God.
  • Sometimes God calls us to minister in obscurity for however long He wants, and sometimes He brings us out of that obscurity
  • Regardless of the attendance barrier that you want to grow or breakthrough, you need to move from doing to equipping.
  • You need to move from being a learner to a leader to a multiplier regardless of what barrier you want to breakthrough
  • The tendency that we have in the West is to copy and to model our ministries off of others rather than looking in the mirror and saying, “Okay. Who do we have here?”
  • Every church is unique. So what does it look like to look at yourself in the mirror, to look at your church in the mirror?
  • Church culture is simply the result of consistent decision-making around shared convictions.
  • It’s one thing for the pastor to have values. It’s another thing for those values to be shared within the organization and for us to make consistent decisions around them.
  • Discipleship is not “Here’s another program,” or, “Here is another study.”
  • How are you moving your entire church toward making disciples that make disciples that make disciples?
  • There are a lot of books written that call churches to mimic “Here’s what we do at our church. Just do this.”
  • What are the micro-shifts that will lead to a macro-change?
  • Close to 40% of America is a part of the gig economy, changing the way that we look at work, life, and love.
  • “You are what you experience” is a lie that’s risen to the surface because of Instagram and because of our culture.

Breakthrough resources in this episode:

The Next Right Thing by Emily P. Freeman

The Pastor by Eugene Peterson

No Silver Bullets by Daniel Im  

You Are What You Do by Daniel Im  

Strengthening the Soul of Your Leadership by Ruth Haley Barton

Daniel Im is the Senior Associate Pastor of Beulah Alliance Church. His latest book is You Are What You Do: And Six Other Lies about Work, Life, and Love. He is also the author of No Silver Bullets and co-author of Planting Missional Churches. He co-hosts the New Churches Q&A Podcast, as well as the IMbetween Podcast. Daniel and his wife, Christina, live in Edmonton, Alberta with their three children. For more information, visit danielim.com and follow him on social media @danielsangi.

14: Marty Jacumin – Bay Leaf Baptist, Raleigh NC

14: Marty Jacumin – Bay Leaf Baptist, Raleigh NC

Breakthrough ideas with Marty:

  • How can a church effectively reach all five of the generations alive today?
  • Wake Forest University is not in Wake Forest, North Carolina, and other learning.
  • Young leaders leaving seminary have a far greater chance to end up in a multigenerational traditional church.
  • Leading a multigenerational church may just be the most exasperating, frustrating thing you will love with all your heart. It is for this pastor.
  • The older generation can, and should provide as much energy as they provide wisdom in your church.
  • Learn to lead your ideal church right where you are… don’t just hunt for it somewhere else.
  • The vast majority of churches are less than 200 in attendance… and most new pastors will step into a small church with an older generation.
  • If you want all generations to participate in the vision, cast a vision from which every generation can lead.
  • If we can get younger leaders and older leaders working together, it shows every generation the value of the other.
  • Love and shepherd people, don’t just try to change them.
  • When your people know you love them and that you want to shepherd them, they will respond to your leadership and the changes you know need to happen.
  • People will stand in the rain to watch their kids sing.
  • What could happen if you took your traditional church events out into the community?
  • Look at what you’re already doing and cast a vision to the church to leverage events to reach the community.
  • If your goal is to make people happy, sell ice cream. Not everybody wants to reach people; some will just want their preference in church.
  • Living into your unique personality and calling brings great freedom. Living without that clarity feels like a prison where someone else holds the key.
  • We don’t make hard decisions to hurt people, but sometimes we make hard decisions that hurt people.
  • Embracing the beauty of every generation, not just the difficulty in leading every generation, brings new life into a church.
  • Lead your people to understand that they wake up on the mission field everyday… they don’t have take trips overseas to be on the mission.
  • How can your church be more strategic through partnerships in reaching the community right around you?
  • Don’t try to become the leader you think people think you should be, become the leader you God has created and is calling you to be.
  • What are the challenges, as well as the benefits, of succeeding a long-tenured pastor who wants to stick around the church?
  • Staying until you are old enough to retire is not a vision for your church… it is a vacuum that often sucks much of the life out of the church.
  • Spend time with your spouse every day. Listen to what they are telling you about what they see in your leadership.
  • Get the leadership input from those who are closest to you, because they know you best and love you the most.
  • Just because someone questions what you are doing, it does not mean they are opposed to you or what you are doing.
  • Questions do not mark an adversary; they often mark an advocate who needs more information than you are giving.
  • Shepherd your family as much as you shepherd your church.

Breakthrough resources in this episode:

Bay Leaf Church

Collaboration Cube

Brothers, We Are Not Professionals by John Piper

Dangerous Calling by Paul David Tripp

Dr. Marty Jacumin was born and raised in the Foothills of North Carolina. He married his beautiful wife, Lori, in 1991 and they have three children. Marty is a graduate of NC State University and Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary, where he also serves as an adjunctive preaching professor. Marty has served Southern Baptists as a trustee at Southeastern Seminary and North Carolina Baptists on the State Board of Directors. Marty also was privileged to be the President of the North Carolina Baptist State Convention Pastors’ Conference in 2010. He has a great conviction and passion for preaching God’s Word. Marty’s desire to see the lost come to faith in Christ and to see believers discipled is evident in his writing, his preaching, and his everyday life.


Episode #5: Eric Geiger

Episode #5: Eric Geiger

Breakthrough ideas with Eric:

  • Leadership transitions will always happen, but what actually makes succession a success?
  • Following God involves holding two conflicting emotions in tension: grieving what has been and anticipating what will be.
  • There will always be unfinished work. The “unconquered territory” reminds us the work is God’s not ours.
  • How can pastors keep their heart connected to the community they are called to reach?
  • In seasons of transition, caring for your family is as important as the mechanics of moving.
  • When it comes to your family don’t try to be perfect… just be ordinary. There is beauty in an ordinary marriage.
  • The demands of ministry will never be satisfied and making approval an idol will end in ruin.
  • People will always be disappointed in some part of your ministry; therefore slow down, care for your family, and play the long game.


Breakthrough resources from this episode:

Love Without Walls  by Laurie Beshore

CSB Bible

The Gospel Project

Insights Team Building Tool 

Designed to Lead by Eric Geiger & Kevin Peck

Simple Church by Eric Geiger & Thom Rainer

How to Ruin Your Life by Eric Geiger 

Spiritual Leadership by Oswald Sanders

The Cross of Christ by John Stott

Auxano’s Leadership Pipeline

E-Myth Revisited by Michael Gerber

Eric Geiger is the Senior Pastor of Mariners Church in Irvine, California. Before moving to Southern California, Eric served as senior vice-president for LifeWay Christian Services. Eric received his doctorate in leadership and church ministry from Southern Seminary. Eric has authored or co-authored several books including the best selling church leadership book, Simple Church. Eric is married to Kaye, and they have two daughters: Eden and Evie. During his free time, Eric enjoys dating his wife, taking his daughters to the beach, and playing basketball.


Episode #2: Dave Rhodes

Episode #2: Dave Rhodes

Breakthrough Ideas with Dave Rhodes:

  • The physical location of your church and the mission of your church should be inseparable.
  • Moving to the fringe of the organization, instead of the center, empowers younger generations to step up and lead.
  • Boomers and Millennials CAN get along; however, each generation must take a different approach to the other.
  • You cannot multiply the church at the rate of possible opportunity, only at the rate of people development.
  • Are you working to rest or resting to rest? Why this matters.

Dave currently works as the Pastor of Discipleship and Movement Initiatives at Grace Fellowship Church and co-founder of Younique in Atlanta, Georgia. He is a sought-after speaker, writer, consultant, and coach. He is the co-founder of Wayfarer, former US Team leader for 3DM, and a collaborative partner for several other movement organizations specializing in discipleship, leadership, and mission.

Breakthrough Resources:

The Divine Conspiracy by Dallas Willard

100 Movements


Church Unique by Will Mancini